my 2 cents

[Slaine mac Roth]

Can someone tell what has happened to this board of late?

When I first came here it was a friendly good natured place where people would have a laugh, a joke and there was a large amount of good natured ribbing.

Now everyone seems to have their axes out to gring and I'm afraid to walk past it in case I get mugged.

[Chasartymac]

Ok i'm rather disturbed at this moment, and i'll put in my opinion as enough is enough.
Alright, chaz, you have a lady friend, great, seeing a pic of you and her, fine, but that one is relatively disgusting. keep your activities in the bedroom please. I think its bad enough the whole online romance crap was on the board in the frist place, but we had the option not to read that, to go to greater extremes to dodge such an avatar would be ludicrous as it will turn up everywhere.
if i offend anyone, i can't say that i care. for such things offend me.

Kyle

I don't think I need to say too much, as everyone has said it all already. BUT.
If my avatar is disturbing to you and offensive because of it's nudity, TOUGH LUCK.

My advise to you would be this, don't ever go onto a public beach or swimming pool, don't ever watch the TV, don't rent any movie other than a Disney, (oh no, that doesn't work either because they kiss in those too), don't ever take your girl to a dinner dance, don't ever go to a party, in fact I'd shut my eyes to just about everything in life.
As my avatar is on the left here, we can analyse the disturbing and offensive qualities. You can see the top of my chest and one of NPG's collar bones and shoulder. In ALL of the examples I gave above, you can see more than that but it seems to be acceptable to wear nothing but swimming costumes at a beach, strapless ballgowns at a function, see naked rear ends on TV and in movies and some times they even simulate sex, (God forbid), and at almost every party I've ever been to I've seen at least one couple kissing. Regarding the offensive picture, someone actually refered to the fact that John and Yoko did almost exactly the same thing on an album cover.

My point is simply that we are showing nothing that a lot of ordinary clothes allow to be seen, and kissing is not offensive at all.
Further more, when the pictures were taken we simply posed for them, they are not bedroom antics.

I think your post about the pictures, and/or my avatar is more offensive than anything we have done or said.
And Aerosmitten, even I would not be so bold or as rude as to tell you to grow up. I'm probably more than twice your age and if you had said that to my face I would probably not be being so diplomatic. If I had a teenage child who spoke like that to one of my friends I would have brought him/her to task on it there and then and demanded they apologise straight away. Agree with SMD or not, but don't tell us to grow up.

[rushlight]

Us talking about love in threads besides our own. Offensive too. Right, got it. I hate to mention it, but I do seem to recall that Rushlight and DA have done that too. But I guess their love story isn't as offensive as ours.

I admit, we have done that a few times but at least I didn't lose my temper when you went off topic where I announced I was going to see D.A. or when Chas was typing to you in my latest topic.

[by-tor]

Enough. I understand some may have a problem with the 'mush', other have a problem with politics, there are even some who have a problem with the sports on here. These things I know, and expect as we are all different people, from different parts of the world brought together by a common like (love? ) for a rock band. I like to let this board run itself, but calling someone out in public is uncool. If you have a problem with someone's postings and/or avatar, the 'grown up' way would be to contact that person in private, in a civil manner. If that doesn't resolve the problem for you, contact one of the moderators or myself. If that doesn't resolve the problem, then you're out of options. Keep in mind that I will not stomp on someone's freedom to express themselves in a manner that would be perfectly acceptable to the majority of the world just to satisfy a notion that someone else has to 'freedom from being offended'. It's a grown up world out there people, and sometimes being offended is part of it.

I've lost one very valued member of this site in the past couple of weeks, because 'the good of the one didn't out-weigh the good of the many'. And as much as I enjoyed that poster's presence here, I couldn't bring myself to suppress a thread to try and keep the poster here. I'll be damned if I'm going to allow users to run each other off. Some of us here have seen the grass on the other side, and I'll shut this puppy down before I resort to that type of censorship.

[Panacea]

I think it's not the amount of skin showing that is at issue so much as that it is obvious you are naked. Some people are uncomfortable with that. Just because John and Yoko did it doesn't mean it's necessarily mainstream. As part of your romance thread, those who don't wish to see it can simply not visit the thread. As an avatar, it is everywhere and cannot be avoided without staying away from the site altogether.

Also, talking about your love was never more than a side issue with SMD that I can see, other than he wasn't thrilled with the romance threads but didn't care because they were easily avoidable. We are happy you found each other, enjoy your company, and wish for you to stay.

[PV]

"Quick to judge, quick to anger, slow to understand..."

These words were just playing on my computer and they brought this thread to mind. They were written by the best lyricist ever. They were sang and played by the best band ever. (Okay... I'm not trying to take this thread off topic so if you feel the need to debate or argue that point, take it elsewhere.) That is what this board is all about, the Rush. And it is the Rush that brought these two wonderful, beautiful people together. Let's try and keep that in mind as that is what is so wonderful and beautiful about By-tor.com. It has brought many wonderful people in to my life and yours.

The issue is NOT the love of Chas and NPG. The issue is, as I see it, that we have youngsters on this board. We have people with different beliefs and backgrounds on this board. We have people with different "standards" on this board. We have all been brought together on this board. We all have the right to say how we feel and we all have the right to have our opinions listened to. Yeah, we'll even extend that right to you non-Americans. Just because someone expresses an opinion that we don't agree with, doesn't mean it is an attack. We all need to respect eachothers' opinions and feelings. No need for anyone to leave. No need for anyone to grow up. PLEASE don't make me grow up!!!

We should not be so quick to judge what others do. We shouldn't be so quick to get angry over someone expressing their opinion. We should be quick to understand that we are all different. We should be quick to embrace those differences. We should be quick to love those differences. To quote another of my favorite bands, Live, "To be alive, I say the colors must swirl." (That song is "The Beauty of Gray" from Mental Jewelry.) Let the colors swirl. And let's enjoy the beauty of gray in that beautiful black and white picture.

With all the crap we have to take, let's embrace the love of Chas and NPG. This world is hard enough to believe sometimes, let's celebrate something good and pure.

Now, let's let this go and handle it privately between the involved parties.

[Walkinghairball]

PLEASE

[Ogg]

I'm taking a self imposed break from this board. I'll nod in for PMs every now and then, and to post in me and Chas' offending threads, but the rest? What's the point when everything we do seems to offend?

Enjoy yourselves, mateys.

No, no, no NPG. I understand you being pissed but leaving surely defeats the object. You have NEVER offended me with any of your posts and I'm sure I speak for the majority here.
In regards to staying 'on topic', hah! Who ever stays on topic in this place eh?
Give it a day to cool down then decide.

I think it's not the amount of skin showing that is at issue so much as that it is obvious you are naked. Some people are uncomfortable with that

My Ged! What is it with the avatar that is so offensive? I just dont geddit.
Two people in love...and they may be nekkid!!! Oh the horror of it all .

[Ogg]

This is so cool!!! All this melodrama and for once I am neither the cause, nor the source of it!!! *does a little happy dance*

*does a little happy dance* So...you're participating in smiling jovial rythmic gyrations? Are you naked whilst doing this? I personally find this offensive ok? .

[Fridge]

I'm quite flabbergasted by this thread....

I mean what on earth is the fuss all about? If two people want to have their own thread then I don't really see what the problem is.
Personally, it's not the way I would conduct a love affair, but I honestly can't see what is so offensive about it. There has been so much negative press about the internet lately, and this could be viewed as a positive aspect of it in bringing together two compatible people who otherwise would not have met.

I do see what certain members mean about the other threads in which this crops up, but offensive? I certainly don't think so. As has been said already, if you can't work out the message after a couple of words, then I suggest you take a class in Remedial English.

What is especially disturbing is the fact that teenagers should be offended by what as far as I can see is a perfectly innocent avatar. There is certainly nothing "pornographic" about it whatsoever. It may be a bit "mushy" for some people, but try and remember that they have conducted a long distance relationship and have only recently met...they are bound to be excited, and in a way it is quite nice to see two people in their thirties (have I got that right? - apologies if not) acting like lovestruck adolescents.

Finally, it does annoy me when people start bringing in the old "religion" chestnut again. If that is the code you wish to live your life by then fine; but don't try and impose your morality on others, as it gets very tedious.

[Slaine mac Roth]

For once I am in total agreement with you Fridge.

Personally, I found nothing at all objectional about the avatar. I'm sure if you searched hard enough you would probably find a similar sort of painting by a great master - no-one seems to object to that (although some people have, in recent years, objected to Michelangelo's statue of David - I think I've got that right, I'm not an art buff). As to the thread, I can't say as I've not been into them.

I've had a closer look at the avatar in question and, as far as I can see, the two of them are not obviously naked (they may have been but that's beside the point). As has been pointed out, they are not showing anymore naked flesh that can be seen while walking down the street on a hot summer day.

I notice that in one of his posts Sir M used the dreaded word morally. As usual, this is trotted out when someone of a particular religous/spiritual viewpoint wishes to impose it upon the world at large.

[Aerosmitten]

The "grow up" was mainly directed at Chas for the way he acts if I goof in his thread. No one else has flipped his/her/it's lid for my non-serious goofing off, but...

And I'd like to make it clear just what was the bother here. (For me, SMD will have to speak for himself)

Chas's avatar. The mush and all were just fine in the threads marked as such. No problems with peeps being in love at all, infact, it's a beautiful thing...people in love. Ya know, there was atleast one pic in a thread for NPG and Chas (perhaps more, I didn't go looking around in there, so I don't know) that would have been just as "offencive" had it been the avatar. But it wasn't showing up wherever Chas posted, it was in the thread that is QUITE easily avoidable if a person does not wish to see such things.

Chas ya might want to check your PMs.

[schuette]

I agree with by-tor....jings that's a scary thought

[neilpeart_gal]

I think it's not the amount of skin showing that is at issue so much as that it is obvious you are naked.

Um for what its worth, we weren't completely naked. Not that it matters. Honestly I can't believe I'm even trying to defend our picture. There is nothing to defend. We can't be held responsible for the sensitivities of others. We try to not be blatantly offensive, but beyond that, whoever doesn't like the picture is just going to have to get over it.

I've wasted so much energy defending Chas and I these days that I really just don't give a shit anymore.

[ElfDude]

This is so cool!!! All this melodrama and for once I am neither the cause, nor the source of it!!! *does a little happy dance*

*does a little happy dance* So...you're participating in smiling jovial rythmic gyrations? Are you naked whilst doing this? I personally find this offensive ok? .

Just the sight of me without a shirt on is offensive enough... let alone if I start gyrating and the blubber starts bouncing around...

I promise, I will post no such avatars or pictures!

Y'know, a few months back Mr. Potato Head publicly asked me (demanded, actually) several times to get rid of a picture I was using in my signature that he found offensive (a pic of Hillary Clinton with a very angry face). I joked with him once or twice about it, but when I saw it really did bug him I took it off. No big deal. You never know what some people may be upset by.